Wanted: 32nd Parallel Type VIIC plans.

[lhdockyard1]

Matt, that is fantastic as FSM is the one magazine I don't have that many copies of. Let me make a little more of a dent in what I have stacked up already and then we can sort something out to make this happen.

Great news on the plans as well. I will scan and save/archive anything that is made available. I have been concerned about the loss of valuable reference material for ages now (Ever since Dwight Hartman's family threw out all the research material Dwight had accumulated when developing his products). Finally have the ability to do something about it. I have also invested in software that will allow me to restore old, worn out plans digitally. I have been experimenting with a number of packages as some are better for some tasks than others and nothing yet is perfect.

So as Sam said, what do we need to do to make this happen. I will do all the work. We just need to set up a dedicated section and a method to make available

Don

[QuarterMaster]

I was with this idea for a long time! We need to move forward. We should have a library, a file section, and ask lhdockyard has proposed a section for manuals, instructions, and plans.

Don,

I have nearly every fine scale modeler magazine dating back to the mid 1980s. I'd be glad to contribute if they are returned after scanning. In addition, I have hundreds of large format drawings of scale Submarine plans that I'd be more than happy to lend for scanning.

YES!!

Gathering an accessible database of ALL this material (drawing, plans, old manuals, etc) for members would help preserve the history of what we do as well.

[thor]

Guys,

Ok, with that in mind, what about tech files for items such as stuffing boxes, bulkhead seals, Full WTC kits files for 3D printing (just supply the lexan tube, motors, shafts, and so on), etc? I have tons of that type of information to give away. You can print them yourself or send the file off to a vendor like Shapeways….

Sound good, Don! I even have the old Flying models magazines from the 80s that had a few submarine articles including Skip Asay's original Type XXIII. The collection is in several boxes. Just let me know when you're ready and I'll ship them off to you.

[lhdockyard1]

Matt
My thinking is, The more information the better so yes to the tech files also.

I will get with you when I am ready to start scanning the magzines. Can scan the plans, manuals, instructions and such at any time so feel free to send them whenever. Probably best in small batches but I will leave this up to you.
This would hold for anybody wishing to donate to the cause.

May I suggest that we move this thread to somewhere more appropriate and also likely to gain the wider range of attention we need it to have to be successful.

We could move it to wherever the EC deems appropriate and then make an announcement of the initiative, its goals and how it can be accessed.

Don

[bob_eissler]

Sounds like this can be a great resource and a good justification for joining us. Seems like there is someone on facebook everyday asking for info like this.

[thor]

Bob,

I agree 100%. I hope the EC will consider keeping this a "members only" incentive as you are suggesting.

[salmon]

This is exciting. I will call vBulletin Monday and see what can be done. There may be a way here already or a third party add-on. Either way, let us make this happen!

Peace,
Tom

[Ralph --- SSBN 598]

Tom, the forum already has a Members Only Section.
I logged off to see if I could get access.
I could not.
Got message to become member.

Seem you could add a topic to that section and have what you want.

[salmon]

Ralph, I am very much aware of our members only section. It is the file saving, organizing section and how to manage the section that I need to figure out. A topic would only be a thread and after a short time become unruly to manage.
Peace,
Tom

[PaulC]

This would be a great new resource. The only concern would be having the legal right to offer material on our pay side that may be copyrighted. Plans and photos created by the US Navy are in the public domain. We have a section for submarine plans. However, anything previously offered for sale, a model maker's plans or instructions for example, might require written permission to be offered -- especially if we were using it's availability as incentive for paid membership. I'm not saying I know how it works, especially with material from vendors or publishers that have since gone out of business, but the copyright issue bears looking into if the material were to become a prominent feature that we promoted.

[sam reichart]

Material like magazines or other copyrighted media aside, people offering 3D files, their own plans, etc. should probably be a membership benefit.

[thor]

Good point, Paul! In the case of Fine Scale Modeler and Flying Models the publishers are long out of business. I'm no lawyer, so I have no idea what happens to the rights to distribute or copy in a situation like that. Any one out there have any legal background on such things?

[Ralph --- SSBN 598]

Depending on year of copyright, there can be 95 years for older works and most recent 70 years after death of author or copyright owner.
Magazines may go out of business but some one or some company owns the copyright.
-------------------------------------------------
From Copyright Advisory Network.

"Most likely for each individual work within the magazine there would be one copyright holder, either the magazine or the creator. Who that copyright owner is depends on a number of factors and may be difficult to determine, especially for older works. If the photographer/author was employed the magazine then their contributions would be considered work for hire, which mean the magazine would own the copyright on those works. However, if the contributers are not employed by the magazine then they may or may not have retained their copyright. Who owns the copyright in that case would most likely be determined by some sort of contract or agreement between the contributer and the magazine.

If the magazine and corporation are no longer in business that does not mean that the work is no longer under copyright. The copyright will still extend for the full copyright term. The copyright would have transferred to someone or some other entity who may or may not at this point realize they are the copyright holder. Works where it is impossible to determine the current copyright holder are referred to as orphan works. Although orphan works are still under copyright your risk in using them may be reduced and that can be factored into a fair use analysis. However, should the copyright holder come forward they would still be within their rights to bring a copyright infringement suit.

This report on orphan works and mass digitization from the US Copyright Office may be of interest to you."

https://www.copyright.gov/orphan/reports/orphan-works2015.pdf

[QuarterMaster]

ALCON,

I would also suggest a "Disclaimer" use at your own risk.

People are people, and I've seen good friends split regarding ideas gone "south", much less the possibility of litigation in a society where one points fingers at others rather than "own" responsibility. Anyone here remember the famous "PVC" Propel tank incident of years ago regarding someones eye? Many a back and forth regarding that.

The Members Only Section is a GREAT idea as offers it as a reward in being a member, especially since the report itself may change and so with it it's lure of it being a benefit of membership.

There is competition for ANY readership, and we need to address this should we remain the #1 site for ANYTHING sub related, and not just the RC stuff.

As for Copyright, yes of course this needs careful attention. Essentially a Joe like myself am tickled pink to share back to a group that has so freely given to me. In fact I'm honored anyone would run and even improve on some hair-brain idea of mine. But many also deservedly feel a more tangible offering is required before they share anything. Not withstanding published materials from outside the SC, say a Greg Sharpe SKIPJACK plans or the aforementioned Magazines.

Heck I just paid Lee Upshaw $40US + shipping for a set of Greg's 688 plans he said he was authorized to sell. I'd love to share them, but can I?? I know any material I authored I would feel happy to and indicate as freely given.

No legal eagle here, but ya'all bring up valid points regarding people and Publishers. In the end we may only be able to "point" to certain things. Like, "Go here for that information"

FWIW, in the end we want to share and have fun. Which if I remember was the original intent of this group back in 1990 when it was a letter among friends.

How do we get from here to there??

[sam reichart]

Don (Loyalhanna)...can you check your PMs please?