Best way to cut holes in deck & hull? - Milling Machine?

[bos10]

[color=#000000]I’m thinking about getting the Engel Type VII/C kit. One of the primary things that I’m concerned about is cutting all of the holes in the deck (see picture below) and hull. I’m not aware of a photo etched aftermarket part, so it looks like a lot of work.



I assume that this can be done with a Dremel drill and files, but that would take a long time and I’m not sure what the results will be. I was hoping to use a basic milling machine. Many of the slots are elongated, so if the hull were mounted perfectly parallel to the table, a perfectly straight slot could be cut by turning the handle on the x-axis (at least in theory). Seems like it would work well on the deck, but I’m not sure about the sides on the hull. I did a little research and it seems like there are several decent entry-level options]

[JWLaRue]

I've been looking at this

I've been looking at this same kit and have been wondering about the same thing.

What is not clear from Engel's web site is whether this kit requires the hull to be watertight like their older/other kits. The specs for the kit speak about a clear tube that the equipment tray slides into. If this works like the robbe U-47 kit, then opening the deck and casing slots would be possible.

Given that it is possible, a milling machine would be a way to open up the slots. It would be tedious given all those slots, but it would definitely result in a much better looking model and should yield good clean looking open slots. Plus as one who has done this sort of thing by hand with files....far easier on the hands!

-Jeff

[silent runner]

If you look closely at

If you look closely at the pictures on engel's site, one can see the tech rack beneath the deck slots. Also, Gantu's video shows the lower flood ports opend as well. I am going to say that this is a wet hull boat considering the kit description states 'a clear lexan water tight cylinder'.

I'm milling the deck on my Type II, which is just shy of 90" long. Even milling takes time, but as Jeff says, the results are well worth the effort.

Mike

[bos10]

Jeff,

I've been doing a lot

Jeff,

I've been doing a lot of research, but have yet to buy anything. It seems that the Engel system is the only commercially proportional system, but a lot of people don’t like it because of its cost and that their watertight hulls make the boats too heavy. I was wondering why they didn’t water proof the mechanics or put it in a WTC…. Maybe they were listening to their critics.

Check out]DiscussionThread[/url]

One person states that he believes that “It will use (from what I have already seen of it) a cylinder and a bajonet ring to close it.” It’s worth downloading the videos on page three if you have a broadband connection. It looks like he’s right -- you can see into the finished hull. Other than not having a photo etched deck, this kit looks great to me.

Have you ever used a milling machine for cutting holes in a hull or deck? I'm trying to figure out if you get a bit the exact diameter of the slot or if you get one that's smaller and then file the remainder.

[Wheelerdealer]

The VIIc from Engel does

The VIIc from Engel does indeed use a WTC (not one that you can swap between subs), that is sealed with a a Bayonet ring.The reason it is a heavy boat is that the WTC is rather long to accomodate the two piston tanks (with piston rods extended). In fact the Lafayette is their only true Dry hull sub.

Yes you can drill out all the opening.According to the Engel Type VIIc manual you need "several 1mm and 2 mm milling cutters" and "NEVER mill entirely to the edge of the actual scribing....... rework with a diamond file"

I have this stuff on .pdf if you need it.





Edited By Wheelerdealer on 1154972906

[JWLaRue]

Yup, I just received the

Yup, I just received the same set of PDFs from Engel. Given the Lexan dive module, one almost has to open up those deck slots!

Depending on your milling skills, you could mill to the correct size. (been there, done that) It would yield the best, consistent look to the slots.

One other thought. Given how deep the deck slots have been molded into the hull, I wonder if they could be opened up by sanding away the backside?

-Jeff

[vanguard]

Are 1mm/2mm Milling cutters available

Are 1mm/2mm Milling cutters available for Dremel drills?

[JWLaRue]

..... It seems that the

..... It seems that the Engel system is the only commercially proportional system, ....

Actually, I have a fully proportional Engel piston in my custom-built Seehund dive module....but the electronics are not from Engel. I use a product that is sold by Nils Canditt in Germany. His unit provides full, proportional control over the entire range of the piston. None of that crazy 0-90-100% setup like in the Engel.

-Jeff

[raalst]

Jeff,

there is a logic

Jeff,

there is a logic to the 0-90-100 approach from engel.
I am talking about the setup in which engel makes the
last 10% of it's piston travel proportional, and the rest not.

the actual depth when submerged is controlled by
varying the buoyancy a very little bit around neutral.
this is the 10% of the tank movement.
using this, the movement in that 10 % can be more precise.

the 90% non-proportional travel is only to have a large
buoyancy on the surface, i.e. to get the whole ct and
a bit of deck out of the water.

at least that is how it was explained to me.

[silent runner]

Engel has recently revised/improved? this

Engel has recently revised/improved? this system with what they refer to as "TMAX".
The Tmax Diving System offers a maximum of features such as proportional as well as individual control of each tank, three fail safe devices (max. depth via pressure switch, loss of signal and battery monitor) and LED status indication.

[Wheelerdealer]

The 90-10 system is used

The 90-10 system is used where the last 10% of the ballast tank is proportional. This is used if its a central or main ballast tank(s). Here you aim to have your boat trimmed for neutral buoyancy at the 90% point and the last 10% is for fine tuning. If you had a central ballast tank to take you to neutral and two trim tanks, then it would be advantages to have the 2 trim tanks 100% proportional. You could of course have a central tank 100% proprotional, but then you'll either have to take her down a bit at a time to find your neutral point everytime you dive, or have a mark on you transmitter where you place the stick to achieve neutral (but with the resolution of the transmitter stick and shaky hands it may be difficult to hit that point accurately every time.



Edited By Wheelerdealer on 1155080945