Kilo Class - Plans required

[yabbie1]

[color=#000000]I am considering the Russian Kilo class diesel-electric submarine for a future scratchbuilt project - I like the shape and its voluminous hull would allow a lot of scope in a relatively small model. I'd like to build to my standard 1]

[gerwalk]

I am considering the Russian

[color=#000000]I am considering the Russian Kilo class diesel-electric submarine for a future scratchbuilt project - I like the shape and its voluminous hull would allow a lot of scope in a relatively small model. I'd like to build to my standard 1]

Hi,
the Trumpeter Kilo is not accurate at all. The hull shape is incorrect, the deck is too high, and there are several details that are also incorrect.

I don't know about plans in that scale. The best plans so far are those available from Russia that when compared to the hundreds of photos available I found them accurate]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v393/Gerwalker/Kilo/corte.jpg[/img]

[yabbie1]

Gerwalk,

Thanks so much for your

Gerwalk,

Thanks so much for your helpful posting. I have a photocopy of the Trumpeter instructions in front of me, including the profiles for painting, and I can see what you mean when I compare it the plans you posted.

Most surprisingly, the Trumpeter sheet shows a parallel hull centre section in plan view and for most of the side profile, whilst the Russian plan shows a hull that is fully tapered in plan, and whose keel line begins to curve upwards from amidsips. There are many other differences too, such as the rounded corners of the control surfaces. A thread I followed in the scale modeller section lead me to a foreign language posting that appeared to be making the same observations.

I guess having a double hull makes it easier for the designers to get closer to the ideal underwater shape. The bad news for me is that the more complex shape will make the plug for my mould harder to make (no two cross sections the same). On the other hand, I like the shape better than the one shown by Trumpeter. So overall this is good news!

My plan will now be to import your bitmap into AutoCAD and reconstruct the drawing making allowance for distortions in reproduction etc. The drawing could then be scaled to any required model size. This could take some time due to other commitments. At least you have saved me from duplicating all the faults of an inaccurate model at twice their original size!

Yabbie1

[gotland]

Dear Yabbie1,

may be You send

Dear Yabbie1,

may be You send a mail to]info@sonar-ev.de[/email]

could be possible, they give You contacts to people who built an accurate model of this boat.

Gotland

[gerwalk]

Yabbie1,
you're welcome! If the foreing

Yabbie1,
you're welcome! If the foreing language forum you mention is in spanish then it was initiated and followed by myself!
I started it as a review of the Trumpeter's Kilo and as we discussed it all (at least the ones we can find!) the inaccuaracies of the model surfaced. Maquette from Russia has a nice little 1/400 kit of the Kilo that better reflects those plans. It's not expensive (~6u$s) at all and you can use it as a 3D reference as well (try the Squadron web site)
Regards

[guillermo pelaez]

Gerwalk,

Perhaps you could translate the

Gerwalk,

Perhaps you could translate the highlights and post it in the Static Modelling section. That post is certainly a must for those undergoing the Trump Kilo.

Take care!

Guillermo

[yabbie1]

Gotland - thanks for the

Gotland - thanks for the tip.

Gerwalk - Yes, I think it must have been your original posting I saw. I have seen the small Maquette kit advertised so I should be able to pick one these up easily as a supplement to your drawing. I have started to trace your drawing onto AutoCAD, but already found some discrepencies eg position of rear hydroplanes in elevation does not match that shown in plan view, and there is obvious distortion, particularly around the bottom left-hand corner. The kit should make a good cross reference.

[gerwalk]

Guillermo]

[color=#000000]Guillermo]

[yabbie1]

Some plans for the Kilo

Some plans for the Kilo class have appeared on eBay, by great_plans, item 6002414314

They show a parallel centre section in plan view, which seems to fit with the aerial photos I have seen - I feel uneasy about the tapered plan shown on the Russian drawings - it would make the hull section a vertical ellipse at the narrow end, where it joins the tail section.

The fact that the pressure hull is even depicted as tapered on the plan view also makes me suspicious - why do this, at greater expense, when you have an outer hull that can be tailored in shape more easily for hydrodynamic reasons?

Can anyone make informed comment on the eBay plans?

[wayne frey]

They look pretty good. I

They look pretty good. I have seen the 3D cutaway before. The sectional is there. Perfect for work like Steve just did on the Type 17.
I put in an inquiry to the seller about this and a few other questions. I will post the answer later.
I will also compair what he has to what I have for accuracy.
The Kilo is getting to be a sub with a lot of minor varients. I am studying this boat still.
I can tell you one of the best model examples came from the germans. I have pictures of an rc 1/60 scale that is most impressive. A 1/72 Oscar II that is way cool also.
Those guys are sharp!!

[anonymous]

Hi i went to the

Hi i went to the subregatta in Kaiserslautern here look at this KILO one.






I post this pic`s in this size to show the acurate of the sub.


Gantu

[gerwalk]

Nice model!! I can't see

Nice model!! I can't see the hull shape]http://zone.sousmarins.free.fr/Photos%202005/chine-carenage-a-sec.jpg[/img]

IMHO the hull shape is not cilyndrical but more like a tear drop as in the russian plans (look at the shadow)

[gotland]

Hello Gerwalk,

look on]http://www.sonar-ev.de/events/treffen05/kl/kl_05.htm

and on]http://www.sonar-ev.de/events/treffen05/gbb/gbb2005.htm

and You

Hello Gerwalk,

look on]http://www.sonar-ev.de/events/treffen05/kl/kl_05.htm[/url]

and on]http://www.sonar-ev.de/events/treffen05/gbb/gbb2005.htm[/url]

and You will find some pics of "Mannis Kilo"

Gotland

[yabbie1]

Thanks to all for your

Thanks to all for your input on this one, I am taking all comments on board and following up leads etc. The lesson seems to be to treat all "evidence" with a certain amount of suspicion, even if it has Russian lettering on it.

The photos I have seen, both of models and full size (allowing for perspective) to me appear to show a parallel centre section... but I remain open minded. I think the shadow in the dry dock photo emphasises the curve of the deck casing.

I am not an absolute stickler for scale accuracy in what will be a working model - and one that will have to operate in a murky rock-infested lake - but would just like to get the basic shape fairly correct. I can still sleep at night (if a little fitfully) with the wrong number of bars in my intake grilles. (-?)

There are certainly some magnificent models to be seen at the German (and other European) meetings! They clearly indulge their passion for fine engineering. I can accept that they have the necessary skills (and the money) but it beats me how they find the time to produce these models.

Yabbie1

[gotland]

Hey Yabbie,

I didn't post the

Hey Yabbie,

I didn't post the links (and I think Gantu the pics) not to bring down You moral )

Well, Germany is a small country with many people living together. It's easy to visit other people. the distances are much smaller than "down under" or in US. So it's easyer to work together. All those big boats are a little bit team-work. Everybody builds his own boat for sure, but it's easy to learn from others, because we phone and see each other 5 or 6 times a year on our big meetings.

Another thing: we don't have competions on model-submarine-meetings. So nobody is afraid to show to other people what he's doing. We try to learn all the time and try to involve beginners with a good potential of PATIENCE and skills.

Be sure all those bigger boats on the pictures are made from scratch. Money doesn't really help. Such modellers have normal proffessions from insurence-agencys to engeneers, from normal workers at Volkswagen or BMW to medical doctors. Also You will find some people in this hobby with less of money, because they are unemploeyd.

Oooh the time.....Yeah, when the day of 24 hours isn't enaugh, take the night also, than You have 48 hours until the next sunrise....

I am sure, You will find a great way to make Your KILO

regards

Gotland