The Future of the SubCommittee?

[sam reichart]

Sam,

Do you think the likes

Sam,

Do you think the likes of Robbe, Graupner etc. will be interested in advertising to a thousand or so individuals, most, if not all whom are already only too well aware of their products?

Andy

Hard to say Andy.
They are used to paying LOT$ more when they advertise in the larger trade rags. Some of those ads costs into the 4 figures, depending on where they put them. (inside front cover, etc.)

For our small fees to advertise, they might be interested, since it's a very targeted audience. But the membership of the club, at roughly 1000, is a far cry from the tens of thousands (or more) that may read magazines such as R/C, Fine Scale Modeler, etc.

[govretired2000]

Microsoft publisher should work.

Microsoft publisher should work.

[JWLaRue]

Carl,

Many thanks for pointing out

Carl,

Many thanks for pointing out that lack!

The Production Editors do various things. Two do text editing at various levels of involvement and two do PageMaker lay-ups.

The SubCommittee owns one copy of PageMaker, it just happens that the two Production Editors and I have our own copied of PageMaker (via work or otherwise). Whomever becomes the new editor would NOT be expected to pay for the software!

The Managing Editor (currently me) has the responsibility for assigning text editing and page lay-up 'assignments' to the support staff. The amount of work that each individual can do for a given issue is part of the ongoing dialogue that we have so as to try to not unncessarily overburden anyone. Tasks/assignments are done based on article/column.

Regarding the level of difficulty in learning PageMaker, I do not believe that it is very difficult to learn.....at least based on my experience. (YMMV!) For the type of page lay-up work that we do for the SCR, there's probably about a dozen things that you need to know how to do in PageMaker. As I have done very recently, I can walk someone through the page lay-up process via NetMeeting in about 30 minutes.

Sam's response to the ad question is quite correct. With only minor exceptions, ads are provided 'camera ready'. For those occasions where it is not, I have worked with the vendor to create their ad, using PageMaker.

(As has also been noted, other publishing programs *could* possibly be used to create the SCR, but the work necessary to evaluate and test any new publishing package will have ot be the responsibility of a new editor. I will be glad to provide input into that process)

One of the areas where an Advertising Editor could really assist the SubCommittee is to look for new sources of ad revenue.....and going to the 'big' vendors is an excellent idea. There is possibly an untapped source of ad revenue that could result in enough additional income that would cover the cost of hired production support!

Please keep the dialogue going!

Jeff

[safrole]

Here's my humble thoughts.

Submarining is

Here's my humble thoughts.

Submarining is very niche in the US, and even abroad is lumped in with watercraft in general to give more clout. It only gets its own magazine (ours) because of the great love we all have for the hobby. This is the driving force behind our volunteers.

Will Graupner see a return on their advertising dollar? I hope they're not reading this, but no, they won't. We're tight knit. New people get herded in the direction the "greeters" send them. It's worth a phone call to sell some ad space but who has time? Maybe a "commisioned" sales person could keep 10% of the annual subscription from new advertisers they hawk in. That would sweeten the pot for me to make some calls. <grin>

I recently got distribution of my brass through Squadron/MMD and I printed a little subcommittee ad in there, hoping to get us some people who like subs but aren't on the web. If the SC Report fails, we don't fail. Our raison d'etre is to support the hobby, such that it is. It is small in the English "world", so if we can't support it with a volunteer driven mag, we should not fret, but still stick to the easier web. The world is only getting more and more internet savvy when seeking nformation.

That said, I wouldn't mind doing a little article on "how to photoetch little things for yourself" Whoever our next editor is, hit me up. But I don't want my political musings edited. <grin>

I like Merriman. He was a very astute correspondent and I can see why he and Jeff are buds. He predated me on this forum, but if people don't want to play with you anymore, there's no point pining for them.

PLUR

[jeffg]

I have already discussed a

I have already discussed a role I would take in keeping our publication going. I hope others will step up. Writing can be hard for many of us but we all need to try. I hope that with Skip Assay passinf on the reins of SubTech perhaps he can give us a few.

Maybe some of thise vendors out there might give us some real in depth applicastion articules to get the best from the products they offer us.

I would be glad to pay a little moree each year. We have enough members maybe editor could be a paying job, a small amount that could help someone keep 3ends together in tough times.

Bubble Bubble.

[seaphoto]

Maybe it is time to

Maybe it is time to look at the entire notion of the Subcommittee and reconsider it. When it started model submarines, particularly r/c model submarines were virtually unknown, and therefore having a widely disseminated source of information was important for the growth of the hobby. In pre-internet days, the only way to accomplish this was via the printed word.

Fast forward a decade, and you have the Internet now as a resource to convey information quickly, if not accurately


For niche hobbies, this has become a cheap and effective way to grow. For example, I get many readers and quite a bit of participation on my Warship Models Underway site. Flame wars? None, I rule it with an Iron Hand. It is there to promote the growth of 1/96 scale warship modeling, and not to be a sandbox for adults. The result is a useful site with none of the BS that has spoiled the Subcommittee.

Dues? None, it is free, supported by a few banners on the site. The cost to maintain the site is very modest.

Members? Who knows, as many or as few as want to participate. I would rather deal with a few people with a shared interest than worry about how to attract a large number of people. I am not trying to sell anything.

Articles? A few, lately a few more as other people pitch in. No deadline - no pressure to put in articles. No worries about people upset because they have not got good value for their dues.

Events? Guys use the message board to set up fun runs and contests.

Time to produce? Whenever I feel like it, not a lot each month; a few minutes to post pictures and articles when they come in. I keep the design simple for that reason; again, I am not trying to impress anyone with my knowledge of web design, just have a functional and utilitarian site that has a very specific purpose.

Think folks, what are you trying to accomplish here? Promote the hobby, or be amateur publishers? It sounds like all the membership revenues go to postage and the production of a magazine who's readership is in decline. As much as I like reading the SCR, it seems that the toll it takes on those who produce it it out of proportion with the utility of the publication, particularly since the useful information can be disseminated freely on the Internet.

Without the need for a revenue stream to produce the magazine, you don't need a lot of people to "run" the club. A couple of people to be webmaster will do the trick. No officers needed, no bookkeeping. Use whatever money is left in the treasury to purchase web space, and put a Paypal donation button on the start page - if everyone who is registered on this board donates one dollar a year you will more pay for the bandwidth many times over. Sell a banner or two and you will have a comfortable surplus.

So, I guess the heart of the issue is, what do you want from the Subcommittee?

Kurt



Edited By seaphoto on 1094707197

[dietzer]

I, for one, think we

I, for one, think we need to keep the SCR going.

After all, one-third to one-half of our membership never visits the message board, and could care less if the message board even exists. These people are expecting to see a magazine arrive every quarter, and that's the reason they pay their dues. If you switch to an online only scenario, most of these members will lost. And remember -- none of them ever started any flame wars...

While I appreciate that a web-only service can be both beneficial and successful with little investment, that's not really applicable. If we were starting a new club with no history, yes, by all means, simply do it online. But the SubCommittee has been around for a long time, long before it really had a strong presence on the web. And it all started with the SCR. Get rid of the SCR, and you've gotten rid of the SubCommittee. You might start another online message board in its place, but it won't be the same. And a lot of people that were counting on their quarterly magazine get hurt in the process.

I do think we could afford a modest increase in the dues, maybe to $30 or $35 a year instead of just $26. I doubt we'd lost many people just because of a $4 - $9 increase in dues. Our dues haven't changed in several years, so that has had no bearing on our renewal rates. People have been leaving for other reasons -- the flame wars drove off many (I nearly left due to the flame wars, but thankfully stuck it out), the slow economy has no doubt driven off others. Not because they couldn't pay their dues, but because they didn't want to invest $1000 in an R/C submarine while worried about their jobs. As we continue to slowly climb out of the recession, I think more people will again pick up the idea of returning to their R/C hobbies.

I do want to say "Thank you" to those who have served this club over the years -- you've done a great job, guys! Not just with the SCR, but with the message board and web site, too. And I'm sure there's more that goes on behind the scenes to support the group then we're ever aware of. Thank you, and keep up the good work!

That's my 2 cents,

Carl

[mit]

Ok Here is thinking "Out

Ok Here is thinking "Out of the Box".

Someone is needed to be responsible for the publication.

Lets "Pay someone". Yeap, what a concept !

Some may say we cannot afford it. Well, I for one am for raising the dues.

$45 , $50 or even $60 per year for this membership is not a lot of money folks.

For the amount of information that we get off this web site and magazine, its a pretty good deal.

Just a thought ...

Nick Kefalas
Member # 2661

[Scale Shipyard / WLU]

Sorry, Nick]

[color=#000000]Sorry, Nick]

[seaphoto]

While I respect Lee's opinion

While I respect Lee's opinion (and I am a current member, so this is not about joining or not) I feel the only thing we are getting for our $ 26 a year is the SCR. Is it worth it? I'd say yes, but that is because we have evidently been getting it subsidized for years. When someone does a valuable task for free, they are saving the membership the equivalent cost. Frankly, I am surprised that just a few people have been willing to do this for so long. I am going to be honest here and say that I would not. Either the SC Report is worth what an equivalent magazine subscription is worth (I am thinking specifically about Model Shipwright, a quarterly produced in England that I think is fairly comparable), or it is not. Model Shipwright costs $ 71.00 a year, plus shipping to the US.

Expensive? You betcha.
Do we need to charge this much? No. But we do need to charge enough to compensate someone who knows what he or she is doing to produce the report in a timely manner. I am guessing about 10K a year ought to do the trick, 2500 per issue. This is enough to guarantee performance, without being excessive. It would mean an increase in dues to $ 36-39 per person – about what Model Railroader costs. The question is, do you want to pay for your magazine, or do you expect it to be a genteel form of welfare? Do you expect volunteers to do work you wouldn't do just to artificially lower the cost of a magazine?

Although I disagree with this entire membership model (I am for a low cost, web based membership that would focus on the growth of the hobby as opposed to be amateur publishers), if you are going to do it, either do it right, or give up the production of the SCR. Don't depend infinity on the largesse of others.

Is the Subcommittee about the production of a magazine?
Or the growth of the hobby?
I'm not much for new age business ideas, but maybe this is the time to define our "core values"

Kurt

[thordesign]

Kurt,

Bravo and well put. You

Kurt,

Bravo and well put. You are I are 100% in agreement here. You have said it MUCH better than I, though. I firmly believe that if we continue to rely on volunterism that the SC is doomed to go the way of the dinosaur in the near future regardless. I believe that the current conversation and attempts to maintain the status quo are only going to delay, for a short period, the inevitable unless we are willing to realize the current model is not viable and we must change or die!

[Rick Teskey]

Hi All
Who makes the final

Hi All
Who makes the final decision on the future of the scr?
The current executive?
I have sent in a few pieces over the years and some have been used and some not ( yet)
I would go $50.00 for a yearly membership ( 4 issues)or keep it the same price but a bi- anual edition.
I would miss most would be the yearly reggattas , that is where you get too see inovation up close .
I would hate too see the report fade in to the distance.
Has Marshal Clarke any input or any others of the "founding fathers"

[Guest]

If the report goes, I

If the report goes, I think the Sub Committee will find it's international membership will vanish.

If the fees are raised to a higher level to fund a professionally produced publication, then I think this will result in a large loss in membership, which could well result in the Sub Committee ending up back at square one.

Andy

[jeffrey j]

If the SCR were to

If the SCR were to go away the same information will be passed along on the SC web site. Contacts would remain, info still shared, modeling tips, events,,, etc. The SubRons are already in place. The SC web site is well established. Vendors can advertise here. Anyone who has been getting the report for any length of time know who the vendors are anyway, and as MattThor mentioned, advertising in the SCR really don't draw in new bussiness. But the banner on the web site did. Why would a yearly SubRegatta go away "If there were no SCR" ? It wouldn't. If the report were to go away, I would hate to see that. But would the SC die as a result, NOPE!!!... Jeff Jones SC#258

[sam reichart]

Jeff-
you're forgetting that a lot

Jeff-
you're forgetting that a lot of the membership doesn't even frequent this site...ever.

some members may not even have or use computers.